heads up mods - Tedup15 the spambot is wreaking havoc!

[kalmar]

The attitudes of others over this are actually annoying me enormously to the point of tears. That is not due to shillyshalley's posts but to the ganging up on somebody just because they have chosen an unusual writing style, and to the reactions of people to my posing an alternative perspective.

Isn't he a personal friend of yours as well ?
Anyway. Yeah, being silly and making daft posts is an art around here, so why is this person being picked on? Well, it's a bit like the difference between pissing about with your friends, talking rubbish and laughing, and what happens when someone runs up to your group and tries to join in, but persists in speaking in a made up, comedy voice and isn't making much sense.
Only a small bit admittedly, but that's why people are already fed up with it, IMO.


Or is there some kind of big-brother like social experiment going on?

[sack]

Shilley_Shalley, masquerade or not, please just go away or begin contributing something of worth to the forum.

As I wrote above, I find the content of shillyshalley's posts similar to that of my usual ones. What happened to being able to insert playful or jokey comments into threads without fear of being labelled a spammer?

Harlequin, you're defensiveness is admired but may be construed annoying when frustrations are running ragged in others.[...]

Am I being defensive?

The attitudes of others over this are actually annoying me enormously to the point of tears. That is not due to shillyshalley's posts but to the ganging up on somebody just because they have chosen an unusual writing style, and to the reactions of people to my posing an alternative perspective.

posting in a way that makes you look and sound unique is one thing - but a deliberate outset to piss people off is just trolling.

you could post in haikus for all I care - you've pretty much always got something reasonable to say and have every right to say it.

All shillyshalley is trying to do is piss people off. shilleyshalley has no other objective. It's not about use of language or freedom of speech it's down to the basic fact someone is being a twat and trying to irritate the hell out of people.

[shillyshalley]

please just go away or begin contributing something of worth to the forum. .

C my HD Topic.

posting in a way that makes you look and sound unique is one thing - but a deliberate outset to piss people off is just trolling.

Look I'M knot. WHY IS everyone out to ATTACK ME.

[piku]

Shilley_Shalley, masquerade or not, please just go away or begin contributing something of worth to the forum.

As I wrote above, I find the content of shillyshalley's posts similar to that of my usual ones. What happened to being able to insert playful or jokey comments into threads without fear of being labelled a spammer?

We got spammed one too many times, reducing our tolerance to stuff that doesn't fit? I'm all for utter random postings (hell, I make enough of my own) however...

Harlequin, you're defensiveness is admired but may be construed annoying when frustrations are running ragged in others.[...]

Am I being defensive?

The attitudes of others over this are actually annoying me enormously to the point of tears. That is not due to shillyshalley's posts but to the ganging up on somebody just because they have chosen an unusual writing style, and to the reactions of people to my posing an alternative perspective.

There's random posting, and there's taking the piss. How would it be if someone chose to replace all their spaces with the word "wanker" as an alternate posting method, or chose to write all their replies in size 19 purple text?

Tolerance to all, unless they're taking the piss and doing it on purpose, which if you really think about it, is going on. If you're not a troll, making a weird trollish post as your first post in a thread that says how few trolls we've had recently is mighty odd. Almost verging on ironic (unless you think about it, in which case it just becomes inevitable someone would do this).

It all strikes me as rather silly and pointless, rather than an alternate way of communicating.

However this is my opinion and I don't particularly dislike anyone here. I'm more tired of it all. It's like Bleating's no fun to be in any more, it's either got locked spam threads or arguments in it. You can't have a laugh and post things without wondering who you're about to upset. I think this whole incident is a fine example.

[darkladywolf]

Harly,

I've been thinking about this myself.

Firstly shillyshalley has already said they're trying to invent a persona. No problems there in general, but that makes you wonder if it's 'real'. I have my own 'persona' RL, I have one here. They're pretty close. Sometimes other personas come out due to the crowd, circumstances or whatever. Some people hide behind them (sometimes without knowing). If one creates a persona deliberately for a place like this, I'm wondering if there's a point? Me, I come here to 'talk' to real people. I think I'd be very disappointed if I met a few RL and found out that what they are here is different to what they are RL. Of course, that's a personal thing, and others may not give a damn.

Secondly, mucking around with the language the way you do, and making 'silly' posts works; perhaps because you seem to have a good command of the language in the first place. I know this point is a bit vague, but I guess what I'm saying is that your 'silly' is subjectively amusing and more 'understandable'.

When you don't know the language that well, then playing around with it makes pretty much a dog's breakfast of it. Some can come off brilliantly, whereas other stuff, especially stuff that is so...hmm...in your face (I'll explain that one in a moment) can just go straight over your head.

In your face? The mixed capitals, the strange use of punctuation and spacing, all seem to jar the "I can read and pattern match" part of the brain. Someone who knows the language well, can often use that to advantage to make a point, to be funny, or whatever. Someone who doesn't use the language well almost derails or stops things dead.

I'm not saying that's necessarily bad, but it does seem pointless for it to keep happening. To me it's a bit like someone continually pulling the same joke on you. It may be funny and interesting the first time, but after a while it palls, and may become irritating.

I'm all for people playing with the language to see what it can do, but if you're trying to actually communicate, then you'd better be damned good at it.

As for your style versus shillyshalley's: you may perceive little difference, but I perceive quite a lot (as I explained somewhat above). Of course sometimes trying to analyse why one type of silliness 'works' and the other doesn't...well...I can't explain the Python fish slapping dance, or some of the Goon's humour. For me, those work. For others it's a load of nonsense.

I guess I'm also wondering, if this style is obviously bugging people (for whatever reason) why continue it? If it's their own style, their 'real persona', then they don't have a lot of choice, but if it's deliberately made up, and it's niggling people, then surely continuing to use it is going to annoy people?

I hope some of this made sense. I've just got up after a night of no sleep.

[Jimaroid]

As I wrote above, I find the content of shillyshalley's posts similar to that of my usual ones.

I would suggest otherwise. The crucial difference for me being that you express yourself with sharp wit, genuinely interesting feeling, intelligence and elucidation. A world apart in both form and content, I feel.

What happened to being able to insert playful or jokey comments into threads without fear of being labelled a spammer?

I don't think anything did, it's still as healthy as it ever was. Again, the difference I see between that and the current situation with S_S's posts is that the style and manner in which it has been done was 'wrong'. Big difference between an occasional interjection with a wry comment/picture and doing that in every post, across many threads, again and again. It has interrupted flow in many discussions and it just doesn't sit as very polite, do you not think?

Am I being defensive?

That is the impression I am getting. Or perhaps it's more an air of uncomfortable diplomacy? The reason I suggested this is that I felt you were burdening yourself with a situation you could do without. I felt you were upset (something I now know to be confirmed true from your post) and that, perhaps, being upset and trying to find logic in others annoyance might not be a good way to level your own upset? I was hoping you might see it similarly.

The attitudes of others over this are actually annoying me enormously to the point of tears. That is not due to shillyshalley's posts but to the ganging up on somebody just because they have chosen an unusual writing style, and to the reactions of people to my posing an alternative perspective.

I am saddened that you're in a situation where you feel in such a way. *random hugs* The problem here, as I see it, is that these are all very distinct issues that have aligned within you as the same problem. Whilst these issues may have some similarity I don't see that they are, or can be, the same problem.

The specific issue of "ganging-up", I think, is not so pervasive as it might seem. There is simple clarity in that a lot of people (vocal in these forums) have been annoyed by one person's behaviour. I don't see any particular organised gang behind this feeling, just a bunch of irritated people that happen to be in the same place.

Please, break the association of yourself away from these issues. You're a well loved and highly respected person in this community, I get the impression you might have some self-doubt in that area. Don't burden yourself by projecting the problems of others through and into your own feelings and relationships, everyone likes you as you.

Lastly. It's good to have you back here, Harlequin.

[Stone]

Am I being defensive?

I think you are too, actually. It comes across that way, at least.

The attitudes of others over this are actually annoying me enormously to the point of tears. That is not due to shillyshalley's posts but to the ganging up on somebody just because they have chosen an unusual writing style, and to the reactions of people to my posing an alternative perspective.

As I see it:

a) Meow posts in a way contrary to house style which makes it hard to read
b) I find this irritating, along with (it seems) plenty of other people
c) You don't find it irritating

Because of b) the traditional thing to do is say 'Look, that's actually quite annoying - you could get your point across a lot more effectively if you took the time to write in full sentences and used punctuation correctly, the same as with other people'. This is, as I recall it, what happened with PG whereby he initially wrote in a more 'challenging' style, people asked if it could be modified a bit and subsequently it became immeasurably more enjoyable and interesting to read his posts.

There's no ganging-up other than in the sense that many people are annoyed by the same things, which is how the house style evolved. For (dare I say it?) the vast majority of us, it's very much easier reading natural-style writing rather than having to decode what's being said before getting the meaning out, to the point that we're so used to it that we resent having to expend extra effort to understand one person. This is what's annoying.

My irrational compulsion to correct things goes off horribly when I see bad spelling and grammar and although I mostly keep it in check, when faced with someone who writes in a style I can't deal with I tend to end up ignoring all their posts' content.

If that's how he types normally, then fine, benefit-of-doubt applies, as with all new posters. Knowing that he's putting it on deliberately to cause a stir makes it doubly irritating.

Does it make more sense now? I'm aware my opinions and those of others aren't always that clear but hopefully we can sort it out without having to have an argument...

Stone

[Snakey]

b) I find this irritating, along with (it seems) plenty of other people

...including Purple Grapefruit

(who, by the way, I hope is still around...)

[merman]

Don't make me start posting planes again

[arron]

If it is someone who has been banned from the forum before, then they know the score already. Just get rid of him (or her).

It's fairly clear from what has been posted that it's (1) a deliberate attempt to decieve and (2) hardly showing respect to anyone with the heavy task of moderation. Although one can have tolerance for those people who have decided not to be good people and wish them well, this does not mean you have to invite them to stay in your house and allow it to treat it as their own knowing what will happen.

[leekfiend]

This is, as I recall it, what happened with PG whereby he initially wrote in a more 'challenging' style, people asked if it could be modified a bit and subsequently it became immeasurably more enjoyable and interesting to read his posts.

Out of interest, has anyone else noticed that this has happened with Crystal_sword? His posts have got way more readable since he started.

Like you say, so has PG, and to echo what Snakey said I hope he's still around, he adds to this forum rather than detracting from it.

I've already made my point about Meow. I've always thought that the policy of this forum is that, once you get banned, that's it - fuck off and don't come back. I'm surprised he's been allowed to continue as long as he has in his current incarnation. It's trolling, pure and simple.

IMO you can tell because, when replied to with "FFS your writing style is unintelligble, sort it out please" or "stop posting all this crap about the X Box 360" your average troll will just totally ignore that and post some random utterance, whereas someone who's just writing a bit funny because that's what they do, or being a bit too much of a fanboy through not paying enough attention (e.g. myself) will go "oh, whoops, sorry" and start at least trying to sort it out.

[piku]

This is, as I recall it, what happened with PG whereby he initially wrote in a more 'challenging' style, people asked if it could be modified a bit and subsequently it became immeasurably more enjoyable and interesting to read his posts.

Out of interest, has anyone else noticed that this has happened with Crystal_sword? His posts have got way more readable since he started.

Like you say, so has PG, and to echo what Snakey said I hope he's still around, he adds to this forum rather than detracting from it.

The posh name for this is "positive re-inforcement". Rather than constantly nagging at people who do things wrong, you encourage them when they do it correctly.

So if someone's trolling, ignore them until they write something intelligent and then reply to that in an equally intelligent way. Psychology is funny like that, it can't not work as it's not a conscious thing. If you're choosing to be an arse, it takes effort and after a while the novelty wears off.