Being killed by bullets not yet at the rim?

skweek · Post by **skweek** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 6:21 am 0

Why are there bullets near the rim? You should be shooting them all back up and off the playfield.

Jamie · Post by **Jamie** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 10:25 am 0

Yeah, i've noticed this too, i'm sure i've got time to place myself and shoot a bullet back down the web only to be killed as soon as I move into place. I've learned not to risk it now although sometimes my instict gets the better of me .

matt · Post by **matt** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 10:52 am 0

I know - those pesky neurons!

Tuur · Post by **Tuur** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 10:57 am 0

Finally found some time to play again yesterday...

I can't say I've noticed a problem with this. When I die I always know it's a fair kill, and I usually see it coming a nanosecond in advance too.

More Giraffing tonight.

sack · Post by **sack** » Wed Sep 05, 2007 1:42 pm 0

skweek wrote:Why are there bullets near the rim? You should be shooting them all back up and off the playfield.

I know - but you think you've got time to come back to that particular problem, you get a good bull run lined up, you get carried away in the moment... bang!

matt · Post by **matt** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 2:24 pm 0

This is continuing to annoy me, so I've made a video.

This is me playing with joypad in my left hand and digital camera in my right. I didn't have to set up any special circumstances, this was just a level with bullets on it...

It's an unmodified AVI straight off my digital camera, taken at 30fps. You'll need Quicktime or something to play it as it's Motion JPEG with mu-Law sound.

http://www.divshare.com/download/1884563-40c (3.8MB)

Here are a set of still images showing the impact-2, impact-1 and impact-0 frames (camera video frame, not game frame).

Thoughts appreciated.

matt

Yak · Post by **Yak** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 2:45 pm 0

er... you ran into a bullet?

No big mystery.

matt · Post by **matt** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 2:51 pm 0

But the bullet is nowhere near the edge? How can it kill me?

I mean, I can even see the epicentre of the explosion is based on the bullet position, rather than the rim/edge/player location...

Or am I missing something?

Jamie · Post by **Jamie** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:03 pm 0

Yeah, this is how i've died several times so i've learnt not to risk it now. Even in that video there's a clear bullet sized gap between the bullet and the rim when the giraffe explodes. How can he have run into it, it should have been shot down the web shouldn't it? It even looks like he's got room to get past it before it gets to the rim.

matt · Post by **matt** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:10 pm 0

I'm not sure the Giraffe does explode at that point.

It looks to me as if the bullet explodes first?! Watch the green tinted explosion with epicentre at bullet location (this explosion lasts for 5 frames of my video). You can see the giraffes tail(?) still in place behind it but because of this event the Giraffe is static/not moving.

Then an instant later a second, subsequent, blue tinted explosion happens. I believe this is the true, unavoidable point of death.

So, I am now wondering why the bullet explodes prematurely in the first place?

matt

ps: I am using MPEGStreamclip to step through the video frame by frame using the cursor keys, as I find it easier to do so than in Quicktime.

Yak · Post by **Yak** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:12 pm 0

eh? in the second pic the bullet's almost touching the giraffe head, and anyway you're not even seeing all the frames if it's captured from a camera.

There are no magical "acting at a distance" bullets. each bullet subtends a zone of influence within which it acts, and it looks like that zone was intersected with the player.

Kamineko · Post by **Kamineko** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:12 pm 0

I'm convinced you're right, matt. I'll have a rummage around and see if I can't rig up the old capture card and have a big close look myself.

Yak · Post by **Yak** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:14 pm 0

There's little point in overanalysing it anyway. It works the way it does and the best thing is just to play and get a feel for how close one can dodge bullets by.

matt · Post by **matt** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:15 pm 0

Yak wrote:eh? in the second pic the bullet's almost touching the giraffe head, and anyway you're not even seeing all the frames if it's captured from a camera.

There are no magical "acting at a distance" bullets. each bullet subtends a zone of influence within which it acts, and it looks like that zone was intersected with the player.

So the Giraffe's head extends some way down the lane and can be hit by bullets? If that's the case then that's my problem, even though it does seem a bit unexpected/unfair.

For me, much as you may not want to hear it, this one mechanic is a bit of a game breaker. Not sure I'll find time to play it to improve knowing that I've got to reprogram my fundamental expectations of where exactly my player is. The head being down the lane makes me have to asses the player in 2D rather than on a simpler 1D plane.

matt

disciple · Post by **disciple** » Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:15 pm 0

matt wrote:I am using MPEGStreamclip to step through the video frame by frame using the cursor keys, as I find it easier to do so than in Quicktime.

Quicktime allows you to step by step with the cursor keys.