Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Inane baanter or words of wisdom - you decide...
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Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by gravy »

There's a fair few people into the demo scene here and for those I'm pretty sure this guy's work is old hat but I only came across his 4k and 64k HW accellerated intros last week.

And they're lovely. Demos to be downloaded or viewed as movies here:

http://rgba.scenesp.org/iq/demoscene/pr ... ctions.htm

One that's I thought particularly ace here:

http://rgba.scenesp.org/iq/demoscene/pr ... iletto.avi

And all in 4096 bytes :)

On top of that he made an excellent presentation to Breakpoint 2007 detailing the approaches he's taken to making these amazing things and other stuff he's considering for the future.

http://rgba.scenesp.org/iq/divulgation/ ... bp2007.pdf

Cracking stuff and a great read :)
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by amanset »

very impressed with how he built up that butterfly texture.
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by sack »

bloody hell that bloke is a bit good - I'm sure once I've gotten this uni assignment done and dusted It'll fit nicely as a 64k game so I'll be revisiting that methinks
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by Nixie »

Thanks for this; I love to see this kind of thing; always allot of creativity. Even though allot of the art assets are a bit on the ugly side. But I'm presuming that since everything has to be coded (due to size restrictions) there's only so much the art guys can do?
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by hugheverett »

thanks for the heads up,
pretty amazing stuff...not checked out the scene for a while, would love to learn this stuff.

this is a good book on the theory, still not read it properly yet

Texturing and Modeling: A Procedural Approach (The Morgan Kaufmann Series in Computer Graphics) (Hardcover)

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Texturing-Model ... 1558608486
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by t0ne »

Absolutely stunning stuff 8)
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by _TinOmen_ »

He is brilliant. The best thing is that he takes time to write articles and share his knowledge. The demo scene is otherwise quite secret and competitive, so people are reluctant to sharing technical info.

Some of his great productions on youtube:
Stiletto 4kb http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcHNzaUBL4Y
Kindernoiser 4kb http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AX8gNyrSWc
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by Cloudane »

It never ceases to amaze me the amount of detail these guys can cram in to a few kilobytes. Microsoft could learn a thing or two eh!
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by Darkflame »

Almost all game firms could learn a thing or too.
[/queue rant about procedural textures being horribly underused ;) ]

But yes, this is it taken to extremes. Very impressive and effective stuff.
Even though allot of the art assets are a bit on the ugly side. But I'm presuming that since everything has to be coded (due to size restrictions) there's only so much the art guys can do?
Yeah, its pretty much code all the way.
However, if your willing to have slightly more filesize, theres tools like this;
http://www.theprodukkt.com/werkkzeug_3_te

That lets you build/layer up textures nicely without needing coding knowledge.
So as far as 2D materials go,art guys can certainly still help with procedural stuff.

Theres also this (old) article about another procedural texture specialist firm;

http://www.bit-tech.net/gaming/2006/11/ ... ture_Gam/1

They are focusing on tools for downloadablys, Live Arcade and such.

3D however, is another mater. I guess in theory you could have 3d modeling done a similar way. Building up from a cube and keeping the modifier stack?
Be quite tricky I think, and not sure the benefits would be much if anything. Mesh's don't take up nearly so much as textures.
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by _TinOmen_ »

Darkflame wrote:3D however, is another mater. I guess in theory you could have 3d modeling done a similar way. Building up from a cube and keeping the modifier stack?
Be quite tricky I think, and not sure the benefits would be much if anything. Mesh's don't take up nearly so much as textures.
Not only in theory, Werkzeug1 did procedural mesh generation in the way you describe years ago :)
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by Darkflame »

oh, and your right, yes.
I saw Werkzueg before, after investigateing "theproduct" but only played about with textures on imported X files, didnt investigated its mesh manipulation abilitys.
Neat.
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by _TinOmen_ »

Cloudane wrote:Microsoft could learn a thing or two eh!
Yeah, definitely. Today everything is totally out of proportion. One Megabyte RAM is really quite a lot, and one GB diskspace is an enoumous amount, yet normal computer Windows/Mac users think of this as being almost nothing and need to keep upgrade their hardware. If everyone wrote their programs with just a tiny thought about runtime/memory efficiency then we could use much simpler hardware for normal software, or have some really stunning (sci/fi movie style) software on the current hardware.
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by limb_clock »

I just can't belive that pixar thing was done witth 4Ks! Unbelivable
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by gumboot »

_TinOmen_ wrote:Kindernoiser 4kb http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AX8gNyrSWc
Looks like an animated quaternion raytraced Julia. Is that what it is?
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Re: Amazing Demo Scene Guy (bit techy)

Post by Cloudane »

_TinOmen_ wrote:
Cloudane wrote:Microsoft could learn a thing or two eh!
Yeah, definitely. Today everything is totally out of proportion. One Megabyte RAM is really quite a lot, and one GB diskspace is an enoumous amount, yet normal computer Windows/Mac users think of this as being almost nothing and need to keep upgrade their hardware. If everyone wrote their programs with just a tiny thought about runtime/memory efficiency then we could use much simpler hardware for normal software, or have some really stunning (sci/fi movie style) software on the current hardware.
Mm, indeed. I think what happened for a long time was everything was constantly getting faster and bigger at a ridiculous rate, when Moore's Law was in full swing, and everyone thought they had more power than they knew what to do with and could afford to write lots of inefficient code. (Or perhaps they thought they needed to, to keep Intel in business)

I'm thinking/hoping that this might reverse soon. Desktop computers seem to be about as powerful as they're going to get for the time being - even the PC I put together 4 years ago is still good enough to near-match the one I built a year ago and the Mac I bought 6 months ago. Back in the day, a 4 year old PC would be a creaking old dinosaur...

The focus now seems to be on making that same hardware fit into smaller and more energy efficient packages (Apple being a decent example) rather than just making tower after tower of the best power they can. Hopefully we might see software follow suit.

Full graphical operating systems used to fit on a floppy disk (QNX, AmigaOS, etc) and apart from being a little prettier they don't seem much different now :)
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