SPACE

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pogo
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Re: SPACE

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Darkflame wrote:I'm still pretty convinced if you chucked a few trillion at the problem we could have probes going at 25% of C without too much issue. Presumably with externally supplied momentum, either via solar sails and a lazer, or some sort of array of satellites around the sun each giving it a little magnetic push as it goes past.
I don’t know. A few trillion is probably the total cost of NASA down the decades, and I don’t see how if instead of lots of little missions they had spent it on one big one we’d be on our way to the stars. To Mars maybe.

The problem is the laws of physics. To e.g. send something like New Horizons but twice as fast, to cut the journey time to the nearest star to 4,000 years (!!), you need to supply four times the energy, as energy = ½mv² scales with the square of speed. But that does not mean 4x the fuel. It means much more as every kg of fuel or power systems you add also needs accelerating. It means bigger rockets with more stages to get off the Earth. And so on.

Do the math and you find that the mass required doesn’t grow quadratically, it grows exponentially.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsiolkovs ... t_equation

It’s mass, not energy, as only reaction mass ejected from the craft will accelerate it. So space lasers aren’t the answer, while solar sails provide far too small a push and only work close to the Sun.

To have any hope of getting to the stars we need to be able to do so from space: bypass the most expensive part of the Tsiolkovsky rocket equation and build and fuel big-ass rockets entirely in space. To do this we need not just a fragile and expensive low-orbit space station but large scale permanent bases in deeper space, probably on or among the asteroids which can supply resources and serve as platforms without the twin burdens of Earth’s gravity and atmosphere we have to contend with launching from here. But we are many decades from that.
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zip accident
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Re: SPACE

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pogo wrote:But we are many decades from that.
Yeah, more decades now than we seemed to be in the 1970s. :(

Mainly because that isn't a priority, instead we get missions to Mars, which isn't a plausible long term base. We could probably build and supply a base on the moon, but that's possible therefore it's too easy, so we have to go to Mars, which is much more difficult and dangerous.
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Re: SPACE

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zip accident wrote:
pogo wrote:But we are many decades from that.
Yeah, more decades now than we seemed to be in the 1970s. :(
The problem is while other things have advanced in leaps and bounds – medicine, computing, communication – we aren’t any better at getting stuff into space. It’s still big-ass chemical rockets, in effect controlled chemical explosions. The technology is even older than the 1970s – rockets that could reach space were first made in WWII.

Back in the 1960s and 1970s many people anticipated, even expected, that similar advances seen in other industries would transform space travel. But it never happened. Many things have been proposed but nothing has come close to being a viable alternative means of propulsion. Except perhaps the ion drive, which uses fuel much more efficiently but operates too slowly to be used for either launch from Earth or for accelerating to the sort of speeds needed to reach the stars.
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Re: SPACE

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As a companion to the last frontal picture here is a true colour version of it:
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The earlier one is not faked, but was made by combining multiple images at different wavelengths to produce a colour picture. Something that’s done quite often with space pictures when there’s more information at ultraviolet or infrared wavelengths we don’t normally see. It was just perhaps a little misleading as people had not seen a true colour version so could have assumed Pluto really was that colourful.
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Re: SPACE

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So what's the real significance of planets being Earth-like in relation to their ability to bear life? Colonization is obviously out of the question for a very long time. Is it just a conscious restriction of "life" to being exceedingly tangible rubber-faced Star Trek aliens rather than Solaris aliens or things with geological-scale metabolisms that we'd probably mine parasitically without ever recognizing as a life form?
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Re: SPACE

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gumboot wrote:So what's the real significance of planets being Earth-like in relation to their ability to bear life? Colonization is obviously out of the question for a very long time. Is it just a conscious restriction of "life" to being exceedingly tangible rubber-faced Star Trek aliens rather than Solaris aliens or things with geological-scale metabolisms that we'd probably mine parasitically without ever recognizing as a life form?
It's a very human-centric view of life.

But the latest Kepler discovery is very much in the "Goldilocks" zone - close enough to get warmth from the Sun, but not too close that it precludes the formation of liquid H2O.
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Re: SPACE

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So... Space. Its kind of big (even at the Speed of Light).

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Re: SPACE

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merman wrote:
gumboot wrote:So what's the real significance of planets being Earth-like in relation to their ability to bear life? Colonization is obviously out of the question for a very long time. Is it just a conscious restriction of "life" to being exceedingly tangible rubber-faced Star Trek aliens rather than Solaris aliens or things with geological-scale metabolisms that we'd probably mine parasitically without ever recognizing as a life form?
It's a very human-centric view of life.

But the latest Kepler discovery is very much in the "Goldilocks" zone - close enough to get warmth from the Sun, but not too close that it precludes the formation of liquid H2O.
Seems like selection bias to assume that there's any such thing as a goldilocks zone. And everything we know about life comes from a sample of n=1.
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Re: SPACE

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gumboot wrote:everything we know about life comes from a sample of n=1.
True.

I am very glad I don't have to say this myself.

From a sample size of one, you can prove nothing, or almost everything, which is worse.
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Re: SPACE

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The moon is great for photos now.
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Re: SPACE

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Tethys, one of Saturn’s moon. A dry cratered rock, except for striking red trails in this colour enhanced image:
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Re: SPACE

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I'd talk to the moving company about that if I were you.
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Re: SPACE

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http://www.spacetelescope.org/images/heic1502a/

Hubble has been busy taking photos of the galaxy Andromeda, the most spectacular one in the sky and the one most like our own among nearby galaxies. The photos have been assembled into a 69536 x 22230 pixel behemoth. Clearly not embeddable. Use the link above to download it if you think your machine can cope: full size is 43GB. Or watch the 4k video below which pans and zooms to give some idea of its size and scale.

It’s hard to appreciate how vast our own galaxy is. It looks like mostly empty space, and with the nearest star 4 light years away, and the centre of the galaxy about 100,000 light years away, you might think there were only a few thousand stars between us and the centre.

But we are in a remote and thinly populated part of the galaxy. We know from observation and our models of the galaxy that it gets much denser and more crowded close to the centre. We also know from the laws of physics how massive the galaxy is. The Andromeda galaxy helps I think as it shows us what our own galaxy would look like roughly if we could see the whole of it at once. Very big and very full of stars.
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Re: SPACE

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Aurora spotted around a brown dwarf in the Lyra constellation, 18 light years away

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-33711161
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Re: SPACE

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A so-called planetary nebula: the Southern Owl.

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