RMD how to best record a piano "at home"

[gilesgoat]

Hi,

my bro plays the piano, he has a room in his home with one of those Yamaha vertical pianos.

The room IIRC is not very big but let's say "you play the piano it sounds ok".

However when he tries to record it with the phone or anything else he tried various things "it always sounds a bit poor" in the recordings.

Now now having stuff like "the $10K microphone" but still being "quite a bit of a hacker/homebrew" ( so he can put together some mixers and/or >1 mic in case ) what can you do "at home" to get "the best results" ?

I mean are there some "tricks" like "stick a mic inside the piano in a certain way" or "use a mic put 3 M away and one 1 M" or stuff like that.

I am no expert of recordings, the only "tricks" I know of it's about "the voice box" ( to record voice ) and "absolutely put one of those fluffy things" ( we once improvised with pure sheep wool, was working as a charm ) in those mics if you have to record outside.

Thanks a lot for any hint

Cheers.

[Dio]

It probably needs a dynamic mic of some kind - nowadays, very reasonable ones are available under £100 - and you will need a reasonably acoustically dead room. As you say, no need for a shield unless it's windy or it's a condenser mic and someone is singing at it (they are very sensitive to spit).

If it's in a normal room with carpet, curtains and lots of furniture (bookshelves full of books are pretty good) then that may deaden the room enough, especially with the curtains closed. If it's in a room with all hard surfaces, particularly a wooden floor, then it will sound like crap unless it's very large.

For singers, the traditional ultra-cheap techniques are to put a duvet over your head or do your singing in a wardrobe full of clothes, although neither is ideal for generating a great vocal performance. So I'd have a go at putting a duvet over the piano (with the mic or phone inside the duvet) as a first bash. If he's still trying the phone, don't put it directly on the piano, put it on a soft surface that can't vibrate. If that's not enough, maybe try to get as many blankets and covers as you can into the room, anything that can deaden the sound. If it's a wood floor it will need covering.

[phattslagg]

Usually a pair of pencil condenser mics. I have a pair of Lauten LA-120’s which are decent for the money.

Run them into an audio interface - something like a Focusrite Scarlett will be ok.

He’ll need two stands + two decent length cables with Neutrik connectors.

Beyond that, it’s a matter of experimentation re. positioning. Basically - point them at the breaks in the frame about 18in away as a starter.

[gilesgoat]

Usually a pair of pencil condenser mics. I have a pair of Lauten LA-120’s which are decent for the money.

Run them into an audio interface - something like a Focusrite Scarlett will be ok.

He’ll need two stands + two decent length cables with Neutrik connectors.

Beyond that, it’s a matter of experimentation re. positioning. Basically - point them at the breaks in the frame about 18in away as a starter.

If I am getting it right the "decent for money" is about 240 pounds ... you talking probably around 300 pounds or more for a setup like this ? ( cables, etc. ) ... more around 500 .. hum .. I see ...

[WiteWulf]

You quickly approach the point where it's cheaper to have a good midi controller, a piano VST and some decent effects. It's certainly a whole lot simpler than trying to mic up and record a real piano.

[phattslagg]

Depends on the project.

Pianoteq is an amazing piece of kit, but it needs a very good controller, ie Kawai VPC1 to make best use of it. However, if you want to get that trendy “felt piano” sound, it’s completely useless. You really need an acoustic setup for that. There are other libraries that specialise in that sound, but as soon as you go down that road, you risk sounding too much like everyone else.

[rowan]

phattslagg's probably given you the best info you're likely to find as I know he'll have first hand experience.

All I'll add is that they're one of the more awkward instruments to mic up well. If you want or need to close mic it, the sound source is of course lots of strings across a fairly large area so you need several mics at least [tried this with varying degrees of failure on a concert grand]. Then you find that there are obscure buzzes & rattles on certain notes inside the instrument which from a distance you may not really notice at all but due to mic placement it comes across *100. And after that you realise the pickup profile of the mic is kind of incompatible with that of the human ear and you have mixing hell and you're kind of guaranteed to introduce artificial tones/timbres.

So yeah, I'd say avoid close mic if possible and probably go for a stereo pair at a bit of a distance to try to get the kind of sound a listener would in the same room.

That said, I think in the end, I got my best results [not great results but also not many attempts or different locations/pianos] by doing a middle+side with a dynamic mic I had on the middle and a decent condensor for the side, a few metres away, then converting to stereo in software. I was pretty limited on kit so it seemed a good idea to try to even out the differences between the different mics I had

[phattslagg]

Yeah, I was recording last week and hit a really weird stereo problem with close mic. One of the notes near the frame break on the right almost only comes out of the left, making it sound really out of place in the stereo field. I concluded it’s because the frame was in the line of sight between the right mic and the string - not only this, but the left mic is likely picking up additional reflections from where the sound waves reflect off the frame. Still, close mic’ing is the sound I wanted, and it was far too late to fix by the time I noticed it.

[(o)(o)]

Here's a very lush recording from your resident micing-advisor, on a delicious Steinway :



The Lewitt LC040 are a bit of a cheaper alternative to the previously mentioned stereo pair and it's a getting a lot of praise for a budget pair (I can source this and other kit at a slight discount if he's in the UK).

https://www.andertons.co.uk/lewitt-lct-040-match-small-diaphragm-instrument-condenser-microphones-stereo-pair

Didn't seen anything about budget - if it's tighter still, PreSonus do a similar pair but (despite having a PreSonus trade account) I think the Lewitt have a bit more sparkle .. AKG C414 pair are going in the other direction around £1300-1400

Yamaha make some very nice acoustic pianos indeed!

[phattslagg]

Here’s the one I was talking about earlier in the thread:

https://smarturl.it/LifeAfterLockdown

[Governmentyard]

https://www.pianobook.co.uk/how-to-sample/