Trump

[THEDARKPRIESTCYRIC]

I live in Indiana which is filled with blood red right wing... I don't understand a lot of people that support Trump especially the women. There is a lesbian girl who works where I do that's diehard Trump supporting Republican buying into the whole Democrats are socialist lies. There is a girl here who thinks Trump is an alpha male and the world needs more men like him (she is also a conspiracy theorist nutjob). My boss voted for Trump because he doesn't want people making $400,000 or more a year getting taxes more because he thinks it will hurt his stocks. Also got the people here afraid of the Democrats coming for their guns

[Kelloggs]

For maximum cognitive dissonance, point out to them, "But you've got guns! That's exactly why you've got guns, to use them to stop anyone who is coming to take your guns!* If that wouldn't be enough, why would you have guns?"

Could be fun. Probably, nothing happens. Maybe, their heads explode.


(* literally, Second Amendment stuff here, right?)

[Barney]

Oh well, it's been a good four years.

Don't be blue, young Snaff, he might win Arizona yet and with it possibly the presidency! Take heart!

[p-saurus]

Oh well, it's been a good four years.

Don't be blue, young Snaff, he might win Arizona yet and with it possibly the presidency! Take heart!

Arizona isn't going to happen. Most of the votes remaining to be counted are from my county, which is the traditionally Democratic part of the state, and from more Democratic parts of the biggest county in the state. Poor snaff is going to have to idolize people like Erdogan, Orban, and Bin Salman from here on out.

[merman]

I live in Indiana which is filled with blood red right wing... I don't understand a lot of people that support Trump especially the women. There is a lesbian girl who works where I do that's diehard Trump supporting Republican buying into the whole Democrats are socialist lies. There is a girl here who thinks Trump is an alpha male and the world needs more men like him (she is also a conspiracy theorist nutjob). My boss voted for Trump because he doesn't want people making $400,000 or more a year getting taxes more because he thinks it will hurt his stocks. Also got the people here afraid of the Democrats coming for their guns

That's the thing I really don't get. Trump INCREASED his share of the vote with women (and specifically white women). Some strange form of Stockholm Syndrome must have been mixed in with the coronavirus over there for women to want four more years of Ol' Pussy Grabber.

[F-ZeroOne]

Methinks Barney is extracting the urine from our resident under-bridge dweller.

[Misfit]

That's the thing I really don't get. Trump INCREASED his share of the vote with women (and specifically white women). Some strange form of Stockholm Syndrome must have been mixed in with the coronavirus over there for women to want four more years of Ol' Pussy Grabber.

And Blacks, and Hispanics.

It's an odd world.

[Mat]

The Hispanic think isn't that surprising to me.
Trump did very well in Florida, particularly among the Hispanic community. When you realise they're mostly of Cuban stock, it makes sense.
Cubans who left Cuba for the States were those who objected to socialism, and therefore most likely lean right.

[KlaxonCow]

There is a lesbian girl who works where I do that's diehard Trump supporting Republican buying into the whole Democrats are socialist lies.

It's the fucking "straight bananas" thing again.

People repeating and propagating beliefs, in complete defiance of their lived reality.

Walk into a supermarket. You are typically first assaulted by the fruit and veg. The bananas are right there in front of your eyes. Look at them.

They are curvy. They have always been curvy for the entire duration of the UK's 40 year membership of the EU. There has never been a nanosecond, in that time, where you couldn't buy a curvy banana, if you so desired.

The EU did not "ban curvy bananas". More over, even if they had, then the fact that at no point has your ability to purchase a curvy banana been curtailed in any fashion whatsoever for the last 40 years, would suggest that the EU is completely ineffective in their quest to ban banana curvature.

It's this weird ability that humans have to deeply believe something, with an intense passion, in complete and utter defiance of the reality that they are directly staring at, right now, as they're saying this shit.

So, you know, Obama was a Kenyan Muslim Communist who wanted to steal all their guns.

He had 8 years - two whole terms - where, any second now, he'd steal all the guns. But no communism actually occurred at any point. Clinton - of the Bill variety - also had 8 years - two terms - where, any second, he'd steal all the guns and bring in a socialist Utopia. But no communism actually occurred at any point.

We were told that, in the year 2000, the world will end. It didn't. Perhaps they mean 2001, because year counting started from one and not zero. Nope, the end of the world still did not occur. Well, it must be the Mayan 2012 thing, surely? No, the End Times did not occur then. Harold Camping gave a good stab at predicting the End of the World - didn't happen - and then he tried again - nope, still nothing.

They believe conservatives are more fiscally responsible. Except Bush Jr. ran up the national debt more than any Democrat before him. And Trump's balance sheet's guaranteed to be dismal - in "Great Depression 2" terms - what with a pandemic landing on his watch. Clinton got it down. Obama didn't make it worse.

Vote Republican. Get shat on. Vote Republican. Get shat on. Vote Republican. Get shat on.

Hmm, perhaps I'm not voting Republican hard enough.

Vote Republican. Get shat on. Vote Republican. Get shat on. Vote Republican. Get shat on.

Nope, I must be doing this wrong. It must be God's perverse "master plan" that everything's supposed to go to shit and I live in misery.

Vote Republican. Get shat on. Vote Republican. Get shat on. Vote Republican. Get shat on.

Well, you know the famous definition of madness, right? Repeating the exact same action, again and again, expecting to get different results.

Democrats win. No guns are stolen. No communism occurs.

But we must keep the Democrats out, as they're going to steal the guns and bring in Communism any second now. Any second... now. Or... now. Okay, the gun-stealing communism is coming in 3... 2... 1... now. It's coming real soon, I tell you. Now... Now... now. Just you wait. You'll see. It'll happen... now.

(50 years later)

Any second now. Mark my words. They're coming for the guns with their communism. Here it comes. Any second... now. Now. Okay, it's coming, I tell you.

[Little stoned kiwi]

It's not as obvious as that though. There are people who think the government should provide security around things such as healthcare, employment, and housing.
Socialism: communism by stealth.

[ThetaReactor]

If you aren't enjoying the show, don't watch. The outcome still has a long way to go. After the final tally there will be recounts, court cases, and maybe even civil war.
Right now it's just a bunch of clowns spinning plates.

I can't just bury my head. I've got to live here. I'm living with my parents atm, trying to keep them safe from the 'rona, and my mom is a Trumpet. There's a moratorium on political discourse, because every time she spouts some right-wing bullshit I respond with facts and then suddenly she doesn't want to discuss things and I just want to put my fucking fist through the wall. I'm stuck in a vortex of bullshit. I have an escape plan, but it'll be a few months before I can fuck off someplace west of here. Maybe Arizona, they've got legal weed now.

And if it were just waiting for the counts to finish, it would be okay. But it's not. There will be fights in court, protests in the streets, and a continuing stream of verbal incontinence issuing forth from the White House. At best there will be a mild reprieve in January when the Cheeto gets evicted, but it's pretty obvious that there are gaping wounds in this country that will take quite a long time to (hopefully) fix. While I do have significant skill in simply ignoring things, and there is very little I can do to help things right now, it remains stressful.

[KlaxonCow]

I'm not endorsing the political message - as this has been used for an "abolish the electoral college" campaign - but just thought that the data visualisation animation is cool, and does neatly demonstrate why election maps are deceptive, as they switch to proportionally-sized population bubbles:



But this does touch on a phenomenon that rarely gets commented on. How large urban centres vote left, while rural folk vote right (because that ain't just the US, something similar happens with the UK election map).

The liberal city mouse should ask itself why the conservative country mouse seems to fucking hate their guts, I feel.

(Also, has the left ever considered - when they obtain power - working on an expanding urbanisation programme, to build more cities and / or "upgrade" small country towns, as that would seemingly win them elections every time.)

[Kelloggs]

My thoughts on your map, KlaxonCow: oh, that's cool!

My thoughts on your thoughts: Hmm. Try this (it's brutally simple thinking, I'm afraid - I've not done too much of it):

When we all lived hunter-gatherer lifestyles, it benefitted us (largely) to keep doing what had led us to survive thus far. Don't go changing too much, or that last change might be the one that leaves you to be eaten by the lion. (conservative)

Once cities were available, they tended to attract the people who wanted to change something, initially better job prospects. There's a potential gradient set up, between rural and urban. The ones who are happy where they are, stay rural. The ones who aren't, move urban. (progressive)

Nowadays, urban is as "complicated" as it gets. No-one moves to the country looking to advance their lives in any way other than "more quiet" (or, I suppose, more farming). It feels to me as if, should someone want to be where things are constantly changing, they need to be urban; conversely, should someone be happy with the way they are, this will be less of a geographical magnet for them.

As I'm seeing it these days, the people who are where they want to be, and want to stay, even if it's at solely local maxima, are the ones we might describe as conservative - especially if that local maximum benefits them and any change might upset that benefit - while the ones who want to see if "the grass is greener on the other side" are the ones who maybe have less to lose and more to gain by being somewhere else, or doing something else - for them, change isn't necessarily going to make them worse off.

As to why the hate? *shrug* I'd love to glibly answer "Trump", but I see him as either a symptom or a shining exemplar, moreso than a cause. Are rural people jealous of townies, breathing in all that pollution, while living in crowded high-rise tower blocks without enough room to swing a cat? Could be. I feel that there's some wisdom to be cained from pondering this... but I'm buggered if I can work out what it is.

Also, re: Electoral College - it strikes me that, if the two(?) states whose votes aren't strictly cast following the popular choice were to decice to do so, the entire EC, paperwork, mechanisms, effort put in, et al. could just be stopped. Just tally up the popular votes, either per state or per capita (literally, one-man-one-vote) and have done with it. For me, it's no so much that it's a bad thing than that it seems to be a bit of a waste of time in this day and age, while only ever either going along with the popular vote or making itself look silly for not doing so.

I should probably not move to America. I'd get shot for thinking too much.

[F-ZeroOne]

As the internet has been pointing out, Trumps demand to “STOP THE COUNT!” Means [1] that Biden would win by default. As per usual for him, he seems unable to realise when a statement cuts both ways (such as when he claimed if Biden won, it would be the result of the most corrupt election in history - which would mean that if Trump won it would also be as the result of the most corrupt election in history... ).

[1] Sorry about the Capital “M”; can’t seem to get rid of it.

[PFVA]

I'm watching Trump speaking in direct