Felonious Feline wrote:I think they need to do this like electing a new pope. Lock them in a room until only 1 comes out.
I'm not certain that choosing a new pope is actually done by deathmatch.
Given that list, I'd go for "locking them in a room and only opening it when the smell of death has died down".
Seriously, though, surely this is the point where Labour should be forcing a general election. Boris was untenable, Truss was the party's choice and only managed 2 PMQs and one crashed economy before being unceremoniously booted out on her arse, surely there can be no confidence in any conservative government given that it's all chaos and their entire manifesto has been thrown out of the window. They literally have no mandate and no support.
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merman wrote:Austerity 2.0 with no mandate from the electorate. Get them out.
They won a mandate from the electorate in December 2019. No one at that point knew about Covid, Ukraine or the consequences of them in terms of debt, price pressures or fuel scarcity/prices.
Whilst it's uncomfortable/difficult for us all we can't have a General Election whenever we disagree with the state of the economy, policy decisions, world events etc. If this would be the case, we'd probably end up with one every month...
A few examples - should we have had a general election because Blair went to war with Iraq which wasn't in any manifesto? Should we have had a general election because he opened the door to Eastern European migration in 2004 which wasn't in the manifesto? Or Major leaving the ERM in 1992? Or Major's Eurosceptic changes and views which changed from being pro-European in the early days of his premiership? Many people voted for Conservatives in 2010, but got a coalition government which mixed policies from both (eg fixed-term parliaments).
Whilst you could argue that those examples did not cause as strong feelings as the current situation, they were all things that weren't in any manifesto.
We have to accept that we won't always agree with a government and have the opportunity to vote them out every 5th year (at most) if we don't think they are doing a good job.
And they have repeatedly torn up, spat on and ignored that manifesto. Right up to this week’s disastrous vote on fracking that was/wasn’t/was a vote of confidence in Truss.
In fact, Truss’s leadership campaign was a long way out of step with the manifesto that won Boris the mandate to rule.
Fixed terms was meant to bring stability. Tories tore that up too when it suited them.
In fact, you can trace all the current instability and Brexit back to the Tory infighting that ousted Thatcher.
No-one is saying Governments should fall on the basis of a single decision. The utter chaos the Tories have unleashed and continue to cause must come to an end for the good of the country.
merman wrote:
And they have repeatedly torn up, spat on and ignored that manifesto. Right up to this week’s disastrous vote on fracking that was/wasn’t/was a vote of confidence in Truss.
In fact, Truss’s leadership campaign was a long way out of step with the manifesto that won Boris the mandate to rule.
In fairness this is all a key part of why she's out.
Much as I hate to say it, we have a democracy that elects a government, not one that elects a president. All the BS peeps on both sides were recently spewing about how "undemocratic" the process of selecting a leader was - it's a bit of a case of "tough titty" - it's the system we have.
And just as many MPs display a misunderstanding of basic political shit. There's the likes of Jenkyns and Dorries insisting that Boris has to come back because "the country elected him". No they fucking didn't! They elected the Tory party, or which he was the leader at the time. Sadly the state of our press is such that simple errors like this aren't called out. Any MP showing this kind of fundamental error should be ridiculed to fuck and back by the papers. Nice easy targets, all fact-based (so kill off the complaints about having to be "impartial".
Felonious Feline wrote:I think they need to do this like electing a new pope. Lock them in a room until only 1 comes out.
I'm not certain that choosing a new pope is actually done by deathmatch.
Given that list, I'd go for "locking them in a room and only opening it when the smell of death has died down".
Seriously, though, surely this is the point where Labour should be forcing a general election. Boris was untenable, Truss was the party's choice and only managed 2 PMQs and one crashed economy before being unceremoniously booted out on her arse, surely there can be no confidence in any conservative government given that it's all chaos and their entire manifesto has been thrown out of the window. They literally have no mandate and no support.
Unfortunately, Labour have no way of forcing a general election. The Tories have a majority of MPs, and not enough of them are likely to vote against the government in a confidence vote if it means an election in which they're likely to lose their seat. And it's been said that no Tory seat is safe atm.
Ollie wrote:and not enough of them are likely to vote against the government in a confidence vote if it means an election in which they're likely to lose their seat.
That's the gamble. Not that it's a gamble where Labour would have anything to lose. Speaking to some friends who are in the conservative party, admittedly "wet" tories who were and remain anti-Brexit amongst other things, they're ready to jump ship. One of them is a conservative councillor in a very conservative ward in London, he's ready to stand as an independent. I can't imagine the feelings are much different in Westminster, any MP who's well-respected in their constituency has the choice of hanging onto the sinking ship in the hope of a miracle, or being a figure who publicly stood up, said "enough is enough" and then stood on their personal merits as an independent conservative. Given reports of conservative MPs under a 3 line whip being physically muscled into the "right" division lobby, I'm not sure the government winning a real confidence motion is as certain as it might seem.
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Johnson flying back from the Caribbean and being considered second favourite shows the state the Tories are in, especially when people who resigned to help get rid of him six weeks ago are now backing him!
merman wrote:Johnson flying back from the Caribbean and being considered second favourite shows the state the Tories are in, especially when people who resigned to help get rid of him six weeks ago are now backing him!
"Take back control", innit.
"Words ought to be a little wild - for they are assaults of thought on the unthinking."
- John Maynard Keynes
It beggars belief that he's even a contender, let alone a fucking front-runner.
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merman wrote:Johnson flying back from the Caribbean and being considered second favourite shows the state the Tories are in, especially when people who resigned to help get rid of him six weeks ago are now backing him!
It's a sitcom?
"My way is the way of not fighting":- the book of Enter the Dragon.
Sorry to ask but is it possible Boris and Liz planned it? I mean Boris resigns, Liz goes in makes an awful mess, and the party re-elects Boris, on the basis of 'he is not so bad'.
That would imply Boris playing some sort of 4d chess. He's not capable of 1d hopscotch.
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