Why were the controls changed from TxK?

[bcass]

So I decided to dip back into TxK for a bit of a comparison to T4K, and I was staggered by how much better the Claw movement is in TxK. I mean, it's absolutely perfect, spot-on in every respect. So why change it so drastically for T4K? It makes the game way more harder than it needs to be, and IMO less enjoyable. Little chance now, I realise, but any chance of a sensitivity option for the analogue stick in any upcoming patches? If it doesn't come, I doubt I'll come back to it once completed. I'll probably end up buying a PSVT so I can play the superior version on the big screen.

[InfernalGrape]

Yeah people would like to adjust sensitivity for stick..

Me personally currently enjoy using d-pad instead (though had to use other means to enable it in pc version)

[rowan]

Yeah people would like to adjust sensitivity for stick..

Me personally currently enjoy using d-pad instead (though had to use other means to enable it in pc version)

What did you do? joy2key?
Me personally, after around 5 hours of T4King I just kind of gelled with the feel of it and by about 10 hours total play, I was totally happy with it on the analogue stick.

[InfernalGrape]

my gamepad (logitech f710) can switch roles of stick and dpad; must say that feel of stick can be also different in different gamepads, so..

[bcass]

I tried with Dualshock4 and official xbox 360 pads. Both were way too sensitive.

[Araxen]

If you are using a DS4 on PC, you can adjust the settings in Steam since Steam supports the DS4 natively. If you start the game from Big Picture mode and hit the PS4 button while in game you can adjust a ton of settings. Stick sensitivity, make the D-pad function as a stick, and button remapping, etc...

[buddh4sack]

I'm using a dualshock 4 on steam, and would love to hear any tips from people on things that make the game feel better for them. Llamasoft gameplay is always so perfectly tight, and I'm feeling like I'm reading the game correctly, but I'm just not getting the responsiveness that I need from the controls. I saw Giles comment that it's "meant" to be this way, but it's really frustrating for me to see a bullet coming at me as I'm spinning around the web, I try to stop, but there's this delay that makes me hit it anyway. (speaking as a player who LOVES the feel of Space Giraffe, T2K, and TxK).

[InfernalGrape]

If you are using a DS4 on PC, you can adjust the settings in Steam since Steam supports the DS4 natively. If you start the game from Big Picture mode and hit the PS4 button while in game you can adjust a ton of settings. Stick sensitivity, make the D-pad function as a stick, and button remapping, etc...

I may sound rude, but i'm against "oh look you can go to big picture in steam lalalalalalalalalalalalalalalala". It's meh workaround of something that is expected to be in each game (remapping, adjusting etc.). It's especially bad when it happens like with recent Groove Coaster game that dont natively see any gamepads yet "oh wow look you can go to big picture and remap it to gamepad there".

[Jamesac]

So that's why I couldn't figure out how to play Groove Coaster to save my life! They were nice enough to send a review code and I'd have loved to have done something with it but I thought I was doing something wrong. It never once occurred to me that something as basic as gamepad support wasn't in an arcade game.

[gilesgoat]

OK FIRST of all, we SHOULD really say T4K IS NOT TXK AND HAS NOT TO BE ! ( for various reasons ) TxK is dead, long live to T4K ..

Said that at this point I am really "I don't know what you're talking 'bout Willis" .. I mean I've been playing T4K over and over and over and over .. and over and over and over and over .. definitely MUCH MORE ( or it's really been SO long ago I can't remember ) than TxK ( in the last 1 year for sure ) and I don't really get it "where's all this big problem ??" ??

You kinda make me think "is there any bug around I don't know of ???" .. because honestly "I can't see why/what makes it 'oh dear oh dear I don't like these controls' thing" ???!!!

I mean I've been playing levels over levels hours over hours and it's like "yeah, that's the game" .. I don't really understand "why all this fuss about the controls" ???

I can guarantee you, unless there's some WEIRD bug around, that "controls are the same of PS4/Xbox One" .. EXCEPT OK there COULD be one issue IFF ( if and only if ) you are playing on some settings that are not 60 FPS, because controls are "sampled/updated" on a frame basis too.

Now if you go 90 Fps/Hz then I can understand "response is different", set 60 Hz/fps and all should go as it should.

You can see also "this is a game that was born for console not for PC", actually it had a bit of a weird story because "natively" was supposed to be a PSVR game that been "stripped down" to be again an 2D only game and I would say "maybe had the worst story" because "natively" is was for PS4, "worst" as in "the PS4 has maybe the less type of work needed" so porting it to Xbox One and PC then it's been like going "from simple to complex to lot more complex" - in A SHORT TIME.

You do it on PS4 "everything works because it just works and the HW is the same for everyone" .. PC .. "you can't have more mess than that in the universe".

Now all this "should be" is "yeah ON A PC GAME, not on a console game" and honestly all those things like "setting for this and that and configuration for this and that are" THE SHITTEST PART OF THE CODING/DEVELOPMENT/MORE TIME CONSUMING/FRUSTRATING/PARANOIA TO TEST YOU CAN BE IN, big companies have people whose job is nothing BUT doing this .. and NOBODY likes to do it, really ..

Anyway said that "doing all that would have took at least 1 more month" and we were on a tight schedule but we'll try to do something.

We'll also try to find the simplest possible solution that involves the less possible fiddling.

Anyway I am getting the impression "only the PCs have this sort of problem" or some people are finding the controls "the same" on the PS4/Xbox one as well ?

If it's "the same" I can only say really "this is like they are designed" and to be honest I don't think the code is SO different from PS Vita so I am wondering "what are actually people feeling ?".

What I can tell you Yak, FUCKLOAD MORE THAN ME, played and finished T4K who knows how many times and he's spent hours and hours and hours and hours balancing this and that "to the idea of what had to be he had in mind" so "I don't think the controls are weird" MAYBE they are different than TxK but "this is what is meant to be".

This is not a TxK "port" or "copy" or "the same game", it isn't.

It can't be, it must NOT be.

Now thanks to that &$#@*(&$*(@#&$@(* guy(s)/girl(s)/whatever(s)/??? that STOLEN MY PS VITA AT BLACKPOOL EXHIBITION I never played TxK any more ( and I really miss my OLED PS Vita )

So I am afraid "I can't remember very well if TxK was so different"

Anyway T4K is a thing about "the zone" you get in "and all goes"

Next game will have only ONE button and ONE stick and ONE menu "Press <whatever> to play", END

[bcass]

At the end of the day, to me, the controls just don't feel anywhere near as nice as they do in TxK. If they were designed that way, then cool, but my feedback (and maybe of others here) is that they ain't as nice as the TxK controls. To me, it feels like a regression, not an improvement. The controls are the very last thing I would have changed from TxK, they were absolutely perfect. The nicest controls I've ever played in a tube-shooter. Why tinker with something that was already perfectly refined?

[InfernalGrape]

on the PS4/Xbox one as well ?

I only saw those people from that video review (Bullet Heaven) from other thread, they were not satisfied on ps4 though as i said their channel is known for false information and mistakes so their "adequecy" is not proven.

So overall its like folks got used to something other and have hard time getting used to how it is now

So that's why I couldn't figure out how to play Groove Coaster to save my life!

I bought Groove Coaster and T4K in one day. Guess what i played for around 10 hours (eat electric death!) and what i couldnt last more than 30 mins (that being said i was a fan of original mobile groove coaster app and surely arcade version is fine).

[Jamesac]

I never got to play TxK so for me the Tempest 4000 controls were fine. Took a couple rounds to learn and then played with surgical precision. Maybe not expecting it to be something else helped?

[gilesgoat]

My problem is that honestly it's been TOO LONG AGO since I touched/played TxK and I truly CAN NOT remember the feeling

BUT I also know that "the controller code as far as I remember I don't think it's that much different".

I know there's some "added inertia" without it, we had it, the game is really DRY DOES NOT feel good at all.

Now there can be something about the 'dead zone' or such of the stick BUT "in all the versions of T4K I played" ( PC ,XBOX, PS4 ) can't really say I felt "anything much different".

So if you tell me "plays differently thank TxK", YES but ALSO this is BY DESIGN one thing I remember a bit since last time I had a bit of a "TxK test" which was ages ago I remember thinking "T4K is a bit more difficult to play than TxK" which again is *BY DESIGN*.

I remember we had some talks ( me and Yak ) about the fact "you don't want it to feel/be identical or people would say it's just the same game" which in our intentions "had not to be" also to avoid the fact that "you can be so good at TxK that now you don't have any new challenge in T4K".

But overall that also makes T4K a game by its own, different from TxK.

To be really honest that never gave me any problem, I just take it as it is.

I think it's a damned if you do damned if you don't situation, make it "the same" and ( some ) people would say "oh it's just the same they changed nothing", make it "different" and ( some ) people will say "Oh it's NOT the same oh my goat why not ?" ..

Anyway I know that "differences from TxK are PURELY INTENTIONAL", it's not the same identical game, it has something different but I think it's still very playable as it is.

[gilesgoat]

At the end of the day, to me, the controls just don't feel anywhere near as nice as they do in TxK. If they were designed that way, then cool, but my feedback (and maybe of others here) is that they ain't as nice as the TxK controls. To me, it feels like a regression, not an improvement. The controls are the very last thing I would have changed from TxK, they were absolutely perfect. The nicest controls I've ever played in a tube-shooter. Why tinker with something that was already perfectly refined?

I would quite disagree with that, I don't think they are "so bad" as you think they are.

I don't know, I've seen quite a few videos of people playing T4K I got sometime the impression "none I've seen played it the way I would have played it", I think you go "too much" for this pin-point-precision when the thing ( to me ) is really more like "Luke use the force", you are almost "trying to do something that does not need to be done"

FREE YOUR MIND, EMBRACE THE TRANCE, GO INTO THE TRANCE GUYS, GO INTO THE TRANCE !