The Sony PS3 thread (apparently *still* obnoxious!)

[zip accident]

Marius wrote:

Just imagine how much simpler for instance inventory management in Oblivion would have been with the Wii controller.

Eh?

I am playing it on a PC with a mouse, the inventory still isn't anything like ideal, but I can't see the Wiimote being much better than a mouse for that particular application. The inventory in Oblivion really does want redesigning.

[fog]

Here's a nice simple Wii racing game that demonstrates the simpler controls then. NFS:Carbon....

Some of those button combos are superb. So intuitive. Is the "B" trigger really designed to be pressed with the Wiimote held sideways?

BTW I know that's not a reflection of the Wiimote, just crap design

[Duck Turkin]

To be honest, after having played with a Wii (still hate the name), I can definitely see it being fun in a large room with friends, but alone it would be like playing Twister by myself.

[disciple]

Wholehearted agreement here. Anyone picking up a game for the first time will manage at best 2 buttons. Only once they've got used to that can they start thinking about using more.

Have to agree, the chemistry classes in Bully illustrate this.



Not having had a PS2 for long I have difficulty trying to press circle, square triangle etc in order as randomly displayed since my brain's thinking "which one is cross again".

You can learn it but it's not intuitive.

Isn't that half the point of that Bully mini-game though? If there was absolutely no thought process involved then it ceases to be a challenge and becomes rather pointless.

I guess you could argue the memorisation of the positions of cross/cricle/square/triangle is part of the game. But I think I'd tend to say that this is a side effect of the joypad having four buttons all under one thumb and although a perfectly valid gameplay mechanic is not actually in the design as such.

I think the idea/concept for the game is more like the music type games like Amplitude or Donkey Konga, rather than button position memorisation, it's one of reacting to what you see on screen.

[Hajile]

It is the buttons, the stupid, utterly stupid number of buttons we have on pads today.
A big action button is fine, Combos and specific-action mapping is not.
And thats needed for pretty much all games.

Sorry, but the idea that the Wiimote isnt more simple is laughable to the point I cant believe people are trying to defend that viewpoint.
How do you do different moves in a tennis game without the wiimote eh?
Button combos.

How do you do it with the wiimote?
You make the action you would in real life.

Infintely more simple.
That goes for just about any sport game.

With a pad you'll be able to actually move your little character around as well, though.

Here's a nice simple Wii racing game that demonstrates the simpler controls then. NFS:Carbon....

Some of those button combos are superb. So intuitive. Is the "B" trigger really designed to be pressed with the Wiimote held sideways?

BTW I know that's not a reflection of the Wiimote, just crap design

Good god.


Compare it to the controls for a NFS game played on a pad. Dunno about anyone else, but the remote's controls looks much simpler to me...

I'd be handy if they could actually show the layout of the buttons on the remote, as well, so people could try to memorize where it all it while the game is loading.

I've just studied it quickly, and I can think of a good few potential gameplay fuckups from that one screen alone.

[Kemper_Boyd]

I think that one screenshot ends the whole 'the magic stick automatically
makes games more fun' BS forever.

[GeeZa]

I think that one screenshot ends the whole 'the magic stick automatically
makes games more fun' BS forever.

You mean the BS that you've invented in your own mind?

[Hajile]

I think that one screenshot ends the whole 'the magic stick automatically
makes games more fun' BS forever.

You mean the BS that you've invented in your own mind?

Huh? Wha? 'ey?

Look at it! Just look at it! It's a bleeding mess!

I have to admit, I find it hilarious that 'user error' and 'crappy design' are so often used to mask the shortcomings of the Wii controller. Considering there's apparently so much of this user error and crappy design, that even if it is the most wonderful controller ever imagined, it must be so easy to get it completely wrong that hardly anyone will notice.

[pyroxian]

I think it's a problem of converting a PS3/360 game to run on a Wii controller. Time will tell if the Burnout controls are just bad design or whether the Wii controller is inadequate.

I'm sure some of those options could be replaced with gestures though (push forward for nitro, pull back for handbrake), and the gears could possibly be mapped onto the nunchuck controller, so you have to reach down and change gear.

Steve

[Deckard]

One duff control layout does not bring down a system - lets wait and see what the (expert) masses (us) say in a few weeks time

And gotta mention it again - shame the PS lost its rumble function (snigger)

[ChunkyMonkey]

Um just walked into the room here. Small question:

whats to stop sony or microsoft constructing a wii type montion controler for their consoles if that mode of control takes off?

I mean 360 got its camera like eye toy. Guitar hero controller comming to 360 as well as PS2.

Shooters people like mouse and keyboard but some like xbox trigger and rumble. Options are out there if you own both platforms.

light guns have been made for all platforms so whats to stop a range of controlers for all platforms to suit personnel needs not to mention DDA.

Hell I'm all for weopon of choice

Actually, and I've been deliberately avoiding mentioning this on here as it's a way off and I don't want to plug it, but we have been working on something for other consoles which we are are now showing to publishers/developers who seem to like what we are showing them and are wanting to bring these kind of games to other formats with our tech (which is very cheap to make compared to Wiimote).

http://uk.gear.ign.com/articles/740/740679p1.html

Since that article went out we've received hate mail from various Nintendo fanboys...including one who wants us to die in a fire apparently. People do seem to get rather nasty about this (please don't be nasty to me on here )

We have started to see some criticism of the Wiimote recently eg http://slate.com/id/2154157

For what it's worth, my view is their controller is actually rather limited (once you're not pointing at the screen it is just a tilt sensor, like the old 'Airpad' and the SIXAXIS) BUT it's Nintendo, and you just know they'll make some fantastic games for it.

Hate mail to the usual address please.

[disciple]

Eh? How is that not crappy design?

NFS:Carbon was a game built for another platform, and you can see it just by looking at the above piccy.

Just like the NFS that EA crapped onto the DS on release time.

It's only there because it's a known brand and is bound to get sales due to lack of competing titles.

[Deckard]

Um just walked into the room here. Small question:

whats to stop sony or microsoft constructing a wii type montion controler for their consoles if that mode of control takes off?

I mean 360 got its camera like eye toy. Guitar hero controller comming to 360 as well as PS2.

Shooters people like mouse and keyboard but some like xbox trigger and rumble. Options are out there if you own both platforms.

light guns have been made for all platforms so whats to stop a range of controlers for all platforms to suit personnel needs not to mention DDA.

Hell I'm all for weopon of choice

Actually, and I've been deliberately avoiding mentioning this on here as it's a way off and I don't want to plug it, but we have been working on something for other consoles which we are are now showing to publishers/developers who seem to like what we are showing them and are wanting to bring these kind of games to other formats with our tech (which is very cheap to make compared to Wiimote).

http://uk.gear.ign.com/articles/740/740679p1.html

Since that article went out we've received hate mail from various Nintendo fanboys...including one who wants us to die in a fire apparently. People do seem to get rather nasty about this (please don't be nasty to me on here )

We have started to see some criticism of the Wiimote recently eg http://slate.com/id/2154157

For what it's worth, my view is their controller is actually rather limited (once you're not pointing at the screen it is just a tilt sensor, like the old 'Airpad' and the SIXAXIS) BUT it's Nintendo, and you just know they'll make some fantastic games for it.

Hate mail to the usual address please.

Good luck but the problem for add ons is always the take up - Nintendo have 100% take up of their Wiimote whereas any peripheral Sony/Microsoft go for will only be partially supported at best...

[Hajile]

Eh? How is that not crappy design?

NFS:Carbon was a game built for another platform, and you can see it just by looking at the above piccy.

Just like the NFS that EA crapped onto the DS on release time.

It's only there because it's a known brand and is bound to get sales due to lack of competing titles.

Oh, Ok, User error, crappy design and not designed for use with multiformat games.

Three excuses.

[disciple]

Eh? How is that not crappy design?

NFS:Carbon was a game built for another platform, and you can see it just by looking at the above piccy.

Just like the NFS that EA crapped onto the DS on release time.

It's only there because it's a known brand and is bound to get sales due to lack of competing titles.

Oh, Ok, User error, crappy design and not designed for use with multiformat games.

Three excuses.

Excuses for what?