EU referendum are you in or out

[venusian]

A 2nd ref would be a mistake, whichever way it went.

If Remain win they'll be something like 50% of the population really, really angry. Voters remorse is an amusing sideshow for the (slightly more) sensible press but polls show there isn't a groundswell of regret.

If Leave win again it'll have been a waste of time and make a workable arrangement with the EU harder to achieve.


Best to get on with kicking the Tories out and making sure they suffer a long-lasting meltdown; make the best of an unwelcome opportunity. At the moment Boris' three legged donkey is the only load-bearing animal in the park. Time to bring in the progressive dancing elephants. Or something.

[gravy]

I dunno

When it's completely clear what the leaving terms actually are shouldn't there be another referendum?

Right now a decision has been made on an abstract concept.

If I went out for a walk and it start pissing down with rain I'd probably get back home rather than idiotically stick to a decision made when it was sunny

[tufty]

A totally non binding decision has been made. You don't like it, I don't like it, and probably even Dave the bacon bonker doesn't like it. But if you think 51.9% is too small a majority to make a major decision on, you probably should have thought that beforehand when it looked like it would go the other way, too.

The rules are the rules, they need to be acted on, and they need to be acted on now. Otherwise that poor girl is going to have to carry on going down the supermarket to get her shit eggs rather than seeing Farmer John.

[The ghost of raids past]

Article 50 wont be invoked until after a new PM has been chosen. If that PM chooses to go to the country then it could be months from now before it activated.

Technically if an election was called and a party stood on a we will not issue Article 50 and the referendum results are going to be ignored and they won then nothing would occur.

If this could happen is debatable, but a minor party has nothing to lose and with the current deep divisions in the Tory and Labour party they may just pull it off.

What really has annoyed me in this whole debate are the people who voted for a joke, didn't think their vote counted, didn't vote or worse still used the vote to show dislike of the current government. The remain campaign, which included the political leaders really should have stressed this is not a vote for how much you like the current government its a vote on the future of the country.

[F-ZeroOne]

One problem I may have wrongly noticed about all this is how there has been a lot of blame and almost hatred aimed towards the more politically naive of us. Whilst understandable and probably fueled by shock, I'd pass a lot of the blame to their main source of info, tabloids. I understand asking for "journalists" to be politically neutral is a murky area but the power these rags have is crazy.

https://inews.co.uk/opinion/comment/kel ... ing-leave/

[KlaxonCow]

Leanne Wood of Plaid Cymru has said that, in light of this "game changer", her party is now going to start pushing the cause of Welsh independence more strongly again.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/201 ... eanne-wood

Admittedly, Wales is not Scotland.

But, equally, it wasn't that long ago when the idea of the SNP having an election landslide and nearly winning an independence referendum wouldn't have seemed too credible either.

If we've learnt something from recent votes, it's that there's absolutely no fucking predicting the general public lately. So you never know.

[snaff]

One problem I may have wrongly noticed about all this is how there has been a lot of blame and almost hatred aimed towards the more politically naive of us. Whilst understandable and probably fueled by shock, I'd pass a lot of the blame to their main source of info, tabloids. I understand asking for "journalists" to be politically neutral is a murky area but the power these rags have is crazy.

https://inews.co.uk/opinion/comment/kel ... ing-leave/

But for as many people as regret their leave vote, there's going to be an equal number who regret voting remain now they see how great it is, though they're not going to make as much fuss as it all worked out well for them in the end. It all cancels out.

[venusian]

When it's completely clear what the leaving terms actually are shouldn't there be another referendum?

Right now a decision has been made on an abstract concept.

That's certainly a defendable position to take but various EU leaders have been clear and explicit that terms won't be discussed until the irrevocable article 50 has been invoked. Unless that changes, a second ref on specific terms isn't practicable.

[gravy]

I know, just making the point that there's a valid moral case for this. The barrier is process rather than anything inherently wrong in having another look when more information is available.

[Orava]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-e ... m-36639846

Once the teams are in place, the negotiations would start. They are likely to be complex and could take a lot longer than two years, especially if the UK wanted to ensure that it retains a full access to the Single Market. However, if there is no unanimous agreement to extend the negotiations, the negotiations would stop and the UK would cease to be a member of the EU.

I think this is the most likely cause, article 50 will be enforced on the UK - UK will not get access to the single market as it will not accept free movement of people. UK will be thrown out with no EEA style agreement whatsoever and this will happen quickly.

[Cloudane]

Anyone on Facebook finding that the popular "compilation of hundreds of racist incidents" album has disappeared? I shared it and now it's gone. Wondering where it went and why.

[Cloudane]

First bit of >5 minutes silence on EUref we've had ever since. Anyone would think England had found something more 'important' to talk about :p

[koogy]

Anyone on Facebook finding that the popular "compilation of hundreds of racist incidents" album has disappeared? I shared it and now it's gone. Wondering where it went and why.

still there for me

https://www.facebook.com/sarah.leblanc. ... 919&type=3

(if that doesn't work search for sarah childs / worrying signs)

and there's also a new facebook group:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/6105888 ... cation=ufi

[Cloudane]

Anyone on Facebook finding that the popular "compilation of hundreds of racist incidents" album has disappeared? I shared it and now it's gone. Wondering where it went and why.

still there for me

https://www.facebook.com/sarah.leblanc. ... 919&type=3

(if that doesn't work search for sarah childs / worrying signs)

and there's also a new facebook group:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/6105888 ... cation=ufi

Yeah it's back now (which has led to everyone telling me after all this silence )
My re-share of it said "this post is no longer available" earlier but has returned.

I'll hazard a guess it got reported as hate in and of itself and Facebook derped and took it down, then realised and put it back again.

[Darkflame]

When it's completely clear what the leaving terms actually are shouldn't there be another referendum?

Right now a decision has been made on an abstract concept.

That's certainly a dependable position to take but various EU leaders have been clear and explicit that terms won't be discussed until the irrevocable article 50 has been invoked. Unless that changes, a second ref on specific terms isn't practicable.

Many specifics could be decided on the UK side though, and should of already.
ie. Will places that previously got EU funding get equivalent funding from the money saved by not being a member.
(I am guessing "no shutup, dont bring that up" is probably the answer but they wont say it out loud.)