tufty wrote:Depends on which way the Tories swing, I'd say. Lurching further to the right and aiming squarely at a no deal exit on 31 October in a vain attempt to pull back some of Farage's vote seems likely, and ultimately a bad thing for everyone.
In the middling long run, only a bad thing if you think the Tories are a necessary part of British politics; which they may actually be.
If Brexit is half as bad as I fear it may be, the party responsible will disolve.
UKIP lost 24 seats, Brexit party gained 29, that's an overall gain of five seats, the Tories and Labour combined lost a shed load more than five seats.
"My way is the way of not fighting":- the book of Enter the Dragon.
There are different ways of interpreting the numbers, such as if you count Labour as pro-Brexit (which let's be honest, under Corbyn they kind of are) - the media will choose whatever way it feels like spinning the result, or just take the braindead approach of "Brexit got the most votes so clearly the people want Brexit"
I'm glad that UKIP got pretty much wiped out, at least. To me it indicates that yes these people want Brexit for various reasons, but they reject the stupid alt-right "totally not racist we just want to be able to say racist things" 4chan/youtube types that have taken over UKIP. Maybe the likes of Carl Benjamin don't have such an influence outside the armpits of the internet after all.
gilesgoat wrote:Erm ... I still don't understand a shit ..
.. so ... what's going to happen next ?
Farage goes to EU blabbling how much he dislikes EU and he gets paid for doing so with taxpayer money ?
Meanwhile the Brexit-NON Brexit is still "totally undefined" despite now as a global sum there are more people that did vote for no Brexit than a Brexit ?
Or that does not count for anything.
So it's still "total destruction" at 31th October or you think they'll get "another extension" into 2020 and so on ?
Nope. Sounds to me like you entirely understood everything.
I mean, yes, none of it makes any actual sense. But, well, "Welcome to Brexit". It's all a bit mad, eh?
"Words ought to be a little wild - for they are assaults of thought on the unthinking."
- John Maynard Keynes
Cloudane wrote:There are different ways of interpreting the numbers, such as if you count Labour as pro-Brexit (which let's be honest, under Corbyn they kind of are) - the media will choose whatever way it feels like spinning the result, or just take the braindead approach of "Brexit got the most votes so clearly the people want Brexit"
I'm glad that UKIP got pretty much wiped out, at least. To me it indicates that yes these people want Brexit for various reasons, but they reject the stupid alt-right "totally not racist we just want to be able to say racist things" 4chan/youtube types that have taken over UKIP. Maybe the likes of Carl Benjamin don't have such an influence outside the armpits of the internet after all.
Yeah but racist or not, you have to hand it to them they were right about Doctor Who becoming shit
"massive retard™", "full of shit™", "tiny bitch™", "retarted™", "a bit of a one trick pony™", "petty™", "simple minded idealistic twat™", "miserable humourless fucker™"
The Brexit Party has insisted that it should have a role in the negotiations with the EU.
Also, the Brexit Party has been advocating for a "clean break" - to leave without a deal, on WTO terms - as soon as possible.
So, umm, they want a role in the negotiations of not having any negotiations? Because they won a victory in the elections that they believe should never have happened, to take seats in a Parliament that they don't want to be a part of?
Because the people who most benefit from EU aid and trade voted against their own interests - fearing immigration in the places that, actually, have the least immigrant populations - to "take back control" to a Westminster elite, in order to show these politicians, that nobody can stand and doesn't trust, who's boss by giving them greater power to fuck them over.
Because, you see, the EU hands out this aid to the most impoverished areas - which, of course, means the areas that Westminster was just leaving to rot and was not remotely interested in helping out, which was why they were so impoverished to qualify for this EU charity in the first place.
Ultimately destroying the very UK that's in the name of "UKIP" or breaking up the Britain that loans the "Br" to Brexit, whilst waving Union flags that'll soon be obsolete, when you have to remove the Scottish Saltire and maybe, in time, also remove the Irish Saltire too (which, by the way, would then simply make it the cross of St.George - England's flag - so the Welsh, who have already started by holding a "March for Independence" that attracted thousands, are just going to adore that one).
In order to keep out the Muslims. You know, those British Muslims who, in majority, actually all come from Pakistan. Which has nothing whatsoever to do with the EU or EU freedom of movement, as Pakistan is a Commonwealth country. Or "the darkies" - you know, the ones that mostly come from the Caribbean. Which, again, is a Commonwealth country and not part of the EU, so is totally unaffected by any of this.
You know, those immigrants that we ASKED to come over, with tempting offers, and pull our arses out of the economic fire... like, well, the economic shit that Brexit is bound to cause, so let's see how long it takes for us to start asking the immigrants to come over again, because we simply can't fucking afford to not have them over here, contributing to improving the economy. Which is what immigration - by all statistical measures - actually does, regardless of the populist narrative.
And all this "look after our own" has, in fact, completely split and polarised the nation. We've been split almost exactly in half and are shouting at each other. So, yeah, that's going to help the good governance and future success of the nation, when we're stuck at each other's throats all the time.
Basically, we appear to have fallen through some kind of black hole and come out in "Bizarro World", where everything is backwards.
And where the turkeys really do - loudly and proudly, with a blinding passion - vote for Christmas.
"Words ought to be a little wild - for they are assaults of thought on the unthinking."
- John Maynard Keynes
KlaxonCow wrote:Ultimately destroying the very UK that's in the name of "UKIP" or breaking up the Britain that loans the "Br" to Brexit, whilst waving Union flags that'll soon be obsolete, when you have to remove the Scottish Saltire and maybe, in time, also remove the Irish Saltire too (which, by the way, would then simply make it the cross of St.George - England's flag - so the Welsh, who have already started by holding a "March for Independence" that attracted thousands, are just going to adore that one).
We'd have to drop the 'Great' also since it's a geographical designation, thx Romans. You can bet most Brits think it's because we're awesome, not because we reside on the larger of the two major British Isles. Not that the Irish are too pleased to learn they live in Little Britain. In Trivial Pursuit: the Shannon is the longest river in the British Isles... prep for toys out of pram.
.. and "if they dare to talk about depression" ... ..
Got that feeling that "the world around you is changing/ed in ways you absolutely DO NOT like and there's absolutely NOTHING you can do to make it different ?"
I am guessing it's unavoidable .. but at the same time "it's still bad, I don't like it".
For a little while there was this feeling of "Europe as a single country", a place for opportunities there and there, free to move and roam no shit attached.
Now it really feels like "nobody is welcomed any more anywhere", nationalisms, rightists, leftists, bullshittisms ... ...
KlaxonCow wrote:The Brexit Party has insisted that it should have a role in the negotiations with the EU.
Based on its results in the EU elections? How is that supposed to work?
They can have a role in the negotiations with the EU when they have representatives elected to Westminster. Those elected to Brussels have a specific job, dealing with day-to-day EU business (a job which they are not going to carry out), the job of defining a future relationship with the EU is entirely down to politicians elected to Westminster.
These are the people who were claiming the EU was encroaching on Westminster's powers, and that this was undemocratic. Now that is exactly what they want to do.
"massive retard™", "full of shit™", "tiny bitch™", "retarted™", "a bit of a one trick pony™", "petty™", "simple minded idealistic twat™", "miserable humourless fucker™"
KlaxonCow wrote:The Brexit Party has insisted that it should have a role in the negotiations with the EU.
Based on its results in the EU elections? How is that supposed to work?
They can have a role in the negotiations with the EU when they have representatives elected to Westminster. Those elected to Brussels have a specific job, dealing with day-to-day EU business (a job which they are not going to carry out), the job of defining a future relationship with the EU is entirely down to politicians elected to Westminster.
These are the people who were claiming the EU was encroaching on Westminster's powers, and that this was undemocratic. Now that is exactly what they want to do.
The thing is is TOTALLY ABSURD that someone "of the Brexit Party" that does NOT want to be in EU is in the EU parliament ..
Doing what ?
Pissing over everyone's else jobs going "no no no no" all time to throw spanners in the cogs ?
Because what else "A Brexit Party" is going to do ? Or maybe/also moaning all time about "the Brexit they want" ?
Of Diogenes it is said: "Asked where he came from, he answered: 'I am a citizen of the world (kosmopolitês)'".
"circle model of identity that states that we should regard ourselves as concentric circles, the first one around the self, next immediate family, extended family, local group, citizens, countrymen, humanity. Within these circles human beings feel a sense of "affinity" or "endearment" towards others, which the Stoics termed Oikeiôsis. The task of world citizens becomes then to "draw the circles somehow towards the centre, making all human beings more like our fellow city dwellers, and so forth"
" And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil."
«"Considerate la vostra semenza:
fatti non foste a viver come bruti,
ma per seguir virtute e canoscenza".»
- "Consider your own seed, made were not to live like brutes but to follow virtue and knowledge"
Absolute_Zero wrote:You can bet most Brits think it's because we're awesome
Some Americans apparently seem to think that too.
Margaret Thatcher, 1950 General Election Address wrote:We Conservatives are not afraid to face the future whatever problem it entails, because it is our earnest desire to make Great Britain great again.
Maggie, of course, was not the first British politician to utilise the "make Britain Great again" pun - or its variant of "let's put the Great back into Great Britain" - nor was this the only time she pulled the old gag out of the patriotic joke bag, but it's significant because her great, devoted, worshipping admirer - who took Thatcherism and relabelled it "Reaganomics" for his home audience - thought this was such a rousing bit of jingoism, he incomprehensibly decided to half inch it for his own Presidential bid in 1980:
Despite the fact that, well, the pun doesn't work anymore. I'm not sure if it's a "British humour / American humor" thing and he was not even aware that there was a "Great Britain" / "Britain Great" pun in there, and just stole it because he actually thought it was a straight-faced piece of patriotism from those Cor Blimey Limeys, or he did realise but didn't give a fuck that it was nonsensical because, after all, slogans are always more akin to poetry than to reasoned rational common sense (i.e. "Brexit means Brexit" - completely tautologically meaningless, but it all sounds very "tough" and "strong leader", which May was, ironically enough, keen to project. Possibly as an insecurity over her gender being perceived as "soft" and wanting to counter it - but, bloody hell, we had Maggie before her, so absolutely no-one was in any doubt that a woman was more than capable of being a brutal uncaring arsehole and projecting "strong leader" was neither necessary nor, as is now more than abundantly clear, remotely true nor, with negotiating skills required at the EU and Westminster rather than a tyrannical "strong loader", at all useful that it's landed us in this current shit heap).
And from a movie star to a TV star, Donald Trump is completely devoid of his own original campaign ideas, so he simply 100% ripped off Reagan's slogan, as if it was his own:
But, thankfully, some folks do appreciate the origins of the slogan and, with a little tweak, restored the comedy back to the phrase again:
"Words ought to be a little wild - for they are assaults of thought on the unthinking."
- John Maynard Keynes
